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Old 06-08-2009, 05:11 PM
Maddie&Jake'sMom Maddie&Jake'sMom is offline
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Exclamation Car Seat Safety and misconceptions (tons of links and info)

Mods, if you want to make this a sticky or something, I don't know, but this was requested I post.

These links were given to me by a friend of mine who makes her life helping parents keep their children safe in carseats. I won't quote the whole thing, but these are ALL from her and she has helped me realize that no matter WHAT others think/say/snicker/laugh under their breath...YOUR child's safety trumps all.



FFing vs. RFing

Locate a Child Passenger Safety Technician HERE who can help you with installing your child's safety seat.

Keep your toddler in a rear-facing car seat until age 2 (not 1)

If you think 1 year and 20 lbs is good enough to FF, then please look at and read about this little boy.
Joel's Journey


From the News-Sentinel
Posted on Mon December 10, 2007
Safer car seats face rear to age 2: study
Studies show fewer injuries to children in crashes than in forward-facing seats.
By Jennifer L. Boen



"Pictures of spine development: the reason a baby should not face forward"


How to do the Pinch Test

The Car Seat Lady

Child car seat advice questioned
Toddlers should face the rear longer, some experts say


How to tell if your RF seat is outgrown
Pics and text HERE


Sacred Journeys
Newborn-Preschool


Sacred Journeys
Preschool - Preteen


RF installation angle. Why we need 45 degrees for newborns, and why we can reduce the installation angle when a child has good head and neck control.

All infants should ride rear-facing until they have reached at least 1 year of age and weigh at least 20 pounds. That means that if your baby reaches 20 pounds before her first birthday, she should remain rear-facing at least until she turns 1 year old. It is best for children to ride rear-facing to the highest weight or height allowed by the manufacturer.

Motor Vehicle Traffic Crashes as a Leading Cause of Death in the United States, 2002

Car-seat.org

NHTSA

Automotive Coalition for Traffic Safety

RF vs. FF Crash Test Footage

Car Seat Site

Safety Belt Safe U.S.A.

Don's Car Seat Page
A guide to child passenger safety on the web


4 years and 40 lbs is the bare minimum recommendation to move a child into a booster seat. A low back booster, really, should never be used with young children. Save that for when a child outgrows the belt positioning boosters, but still needs a booster to fit the seatbelt properly.

5 point harnessing IS safer than a booster seat, and especially safer than a no-back booster.

Once a child meets the minimum age and weight recommendations, AND can sit properly in a booster seat EACH and EVERY time they are in the car, for the ENTIRE length of the trip, then a booster seat is adequate (harnessing still safer, but booster ok).

Here are resources on booster seat information:

mentions weight and maturity

2005 Data: Car crashes #2 cause of death for ages 1-3, and #1 cause of death ages 4-34

High Back Booster seat crash test

5 point harness crash test

re: the crash tests: notice how much less movement the harnessed crash test dummy endures – this is a very good thing.

The CHOP on child safety seats

The Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia on booster seats

Why We Use Booster Seats (on pg 2, point #3 it gives age and weight guidelines of ‘about’ age 4 & 40 lbs)

www.-car-seat.org - a board FULL of Nationally Certified Safety Seat Technicians who can address questions and concerns.
An informative thread on why a person should not move their too young child into a booster seat.

My favorite saying (paraphrased):
The laws of physics do not care about what the law of your state says.

Here are the links to some crash tests of booster seats:
Click on crash test #4, it is with a child dummy in a backless booster

Another backless booster crash test, side impact.

HERE is a study that says children under 5 in BPBs have a higher rate of head injuries.

These videos are great, lots of good information.

Child Safety Seats

It's great because they go from infant all the way through booster seats.
I've noticed a few minor discrepancies, especially regarding boosters, but overall, really well done.

They also have videos about travel vests and integrated seats.

I hadn't seen them before, they have really good info in.

The Cost Of Babies Flying Gratis

Child Safety on Airplanes
PRINTABLE Brochure to take on the plane (Make sure you take your restraint's manual as well!!
FAA Advisory Circular

Note that they 'recommend' FF when a child is 20 lbs. It's NOT a requirement.
So long as you are using your restraint per manufacturer guidelines, RF beyond 20 lbs is legal on the plane.


5 Step Test for graduating out of a booster seat


Danger For Rent
For just a few dollars a day, parents can rent child car seats at Advantage Rent-A-Car. But instead of paying for safety, our hidden cameras found parents may be renting broken, dirty and dangerous car seats.


Advantage Rent-A-Car's Frightening Car Seats

Small buses are like 'regular' vehicles, that is why the need for seat belts &/or restraints.

The large buses use Compartmentalization (seat backs have to be a certain height and seats have to be a certain distance apart) for safety.


NHTSA on school bus safety

The National Coalition for School Bus Safety




Q&A from another board:

Quote:
So, the questions I have:
1 - does it make sense to get a 7.5 year old 1st grader a harness seat if she sits well in a booster?
2 - is the Radian 80 a good choice if she is comfortable or do I need to look at a different seat?
3 - getting a harness seat might make it easier to get 3 accross our Accord (having room to buckle her seat is our current issue), but would we want to get one for our Sienna van when she sits in the 3rd row?
4 - if the Radian 80 is a good choice, she would want Pink...can you buy replacement covers for when I need to move one of her younger brothers into that seat?
Answers:

Quote:
1) Is it a passing fancy? Harnessing is safer, spreads crash forces over a greater area, more points of contact, less chance of ejection.... BUT, if she sits well in a booster seat (hoping it is a highback), then it's really a parental decision at this point as to what you want for her.

2) I wouldn't do a convertible for a 7.5 Y/O.
The Graco Nautilus harnesses to 65 lbs, then converts to a nice highback booster, then backless once the belt guide is outgrown.
So, if she is closer to 60 lbs, and her torso still fits in teh marathon, then this seat would be one option. Top slots are 18.5".

The Britax Frontier is another option, though the top slots are a bit lower than the Nautilus, at 18.25", it harnesses to 80 lbs.

The Britax Regent would be the longest harnessing seat, 19.25" top slots, harnesses to 80 lbs.

3) What is she in currently?
If space is an issue, then the Radian 80 would be a better choice, depending on torso height. Top slots are 18", SKR allows the seat to be used when the shoulders are up to 1" over the top slots (though, MANY 'pros' and other concerned parents are not comfortable with that allowance.... FWIW...)

4) Yes
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Last edited by Mom; 06-13-2009 at 01:40 AM.
  #2  
Old 06-08-2009, 05:44 PM
Suzanne Suzanne is offline
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So, booster seat question for you. Why is a backless booster any worse then a tall back booster? I mean, if the seatbelt falls into the right position on the chest, what does the fact that it does, or doesn't have a back, have to do with it? (no snark, that info was great, just something I've always wondered) The back would jut make a child sit more forward, not changing the belt position at all. Right?
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  #3  
Old 06-08-2009, 05:50 PM
symphony of pixels symphony of pixels is offline
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In side impact, high back boosters test better(at least, high back boosters that are just boosters, not from a combination seat) But, when it's just a crash with forward movement, then backless test better(or at least they did the last time I took the CPS training)
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Old 06-08-2009, 05:56 PM
zukeypur zukeypur is offline
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Our high back booster offers side impact protection, which you cannot get from a backless booster. It also holds the belt in the correct position over the length of her torso. Some vehicles anchor the top of the seatbelt in positions that don't provide the ability for correct belt positioning through the shoulder area. It's not always a matter of height (which a backless booster addresses), but the angle of the belt. Our belts would rub Abby's neck if she were in a backless booster, but we don't have that problem with the HBB.

This is my opinion.....I'm not a professional
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Yes, I DO realize that I mention bean and cheese burritos in at least every 3rd post. This will not end until Rosas takes away my key fob coupon that gives me a free bean and cheese burrito with a drink purchase. They have finally limited me to one bean and cheese burrito per visit.
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Old 06-08-2009, 05:56 PM
mommytoonegirl mommytoonegirl is offline
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So dd is 18 months (this month), she's rear facing still in a blvd. She's relatively tall, her shoulder straps are at/below her shoulders which is what I've always heard for rear facing straps. We are hesitant to turn her because she's so tiny (thin), and she's still comfy rear facing. Are her straps at the right place for rear facing--at or below the shoulders?
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:00 PM
Sheeple Sheeple is offline
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That's a great collection of links, thanks for posting this!
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  #7  
Old 06-08-2009, 06:12 PM
Suzanne Suzanne is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zukeypur View Post
Our high back booster offers side impact protection, which you cannot get from a backless booster. It also holds the belt in the correct position over the length of her torso. Some vehicles anchor the top of the seatbelt in positions that don't provide the ability for correct belt positioning through the shoulder area. It's not always a matter of height (which a backless booster addresses), but the angle of the belt. Our belts would rub Abby's neck if she were in a backless booster, but we don't have that problem with the HBB.

This is my opinion.....I'm not a professional
Ah, ok, that makes sense. I see no difference in my oldest son with the way the belt falls with backless vs high back.

And again, no snark at all, how on earth does a high back offer any side impact protection?
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:14 PM
CountryBarbie225 CountryBarbie225 is offline
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I have a Britax Parkway HBB for my 61/2 yo and with this HBB at least (I can't speak for others since I don't know) the wings are the top almost go around his head and in the torso area there are wings again that curve in much like a regular carseat would.
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:16 PM
My3sons My3sons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytoonegirl View Post
So dd is 18 months (this month), she's rear facing still in a blvd. She's relatively tall, her shoulder straps are at/below her shoulders which is what I've always heard for rear facing straps. We are hesitant to turn her because she's so tiny (thin), and she's still comfy rear facing. Are her straps at the right place for rear facing--at or below the shoulders?
Yep. As long as she is below the weight max, there is 1" of shell above her head, and the straps are at or below her shoulders she can still rear face.
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:27 PM
Suzanne Suzanne is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mommy2FourNY View Post
I have a Britax Parkway HBB for my 61/2 yo and with this HBB at least (I can't speak for others since I don't know) the wings are the top almost go around his head and in the torso area there are wings again that curve in much like a regular carseat would.
No way! Our high back booster is just like, a straight back. It didn't even dawn on me that they would have ones that curve around the sides like that.
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:27 PM
zukeypur zukeypur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzanne View Post
Ah, ok, that makes sense. I see no difference in my oldest son with the way the belt falls with backless vs high back.

And again, no snark at all, how on earth does a high back offer any side impact protection?
It's this one.

In the pink/chocolate daisy print, of course.
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Angie, mama to THREE girls! Harper Noelle is here!!!
Yes, I DO realize that I mention bean and cheese burritos in at least every 3rd post. This will not end until Rosas takes away my key fob coupon that gives me a free bean and cheese burrito with a drink purchase. They have finally limited me to one bean and cheese burrito per visit.
Please remember to use proper CaPiTaLiZaTiOn....It's the difference between "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse," and "I helped my uncle jack off a horse."
  #12  
Old 06-08-2009, 06:33 PM
Suzanne Suzanne is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zukeypur View Post
It's this one.

In the pink/chocolate daisy print, of course.
oh DANG! That's one hell of a booster seat! And you know, it looks WAY more comfortable then the one(s) we have. Cooper misses having a place to rest his head on a long trip.
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  #13  
Old 06-08-2009, 08:22 PM
zukeypur zukeypur is offline
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Abby loves it. She's been using it for about 2 years, and won't get out of it anytime soon. She's only 41 lbs and 10 years old.
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Angie, mama to THREE girls! Harper Noelle is here!!!
Yes, I DO realize that I mention bean and cheese burritos in at least every 3rd post. This will not end until Rosas takes away my key fob coupon that gives me a free bean and cheese burrito with a drink purchase. They have finally limited me to one bean and cheese burrito per visit.
Please remember to use proper CaPiTaLiZaTiOn....It's the difference between "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse," and "I helped my uncle jack off a horse."
  #14  
Old 06-08-2009, 08:29 PM
SuzieSunshine SuzieSunshine is offline
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The high back booster ensures the belt is positioned properly when compared to the backless. It routes below the neck and across the torso at the proper place. That's hard to to with backless, because seatbelts really just aren't designed for children.
  #15  
Old 06-08-2009, 08:41 PM
Maddie&Jake'sMom Maddie&Jake'sMom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProudDomesticEngineer View Post
The high back booster ensures the belt is positioned properly when compared to the backless. It routes below the neck and across the torso at the proper place. That's hard to to with backless, because seatbelts really just aren't designed for children.
Or adults. I'm 5 feet and I still have issue with my seatbelts all of the time.
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